07-03-2008
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#32 (permalink)
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thats why i don't like hospitals. yet another place to be reminded that you're a minority in the care of people who don't care | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#34 (permalink)
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This is truely sad.
it's the EMERGENCY Psychiatric room... and this happened.
Woman falls over out of chair lays there for half an hour is seen by a security guard laying on the floor and ignored. another half hr goes by before another patient goes and gets someone. Come on people... it's sad when the crazy people are more sane and caring than the staff!
Oh and the record logs were falsified, something to the effect of
6:00am Sitting quietly, got up to use the rest room
6:30am Sitting quietly {this is when she's been lying face down on the floor for a freakin' half hr}
7:00 patient found dead | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#35 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dong20  What?
If you think this is an 'America Bashing' thread when I went out of my way to illustrate it wasn't - you highlighted the relevant commentary yourself* ... wait you're joking, right?
*The 'does nobody read the news' jibe was an evidently too subtle attempt at sardonic humour - based on the 'timelag' I've seen in people posting topical items - an observation I have made here before.
before you jumped in the deep end making accusations you should have asked yourself; have I ever 'bashed' America as an end itself and/or in the vein of others here?
People will of course infer what they will, and the track record on the validity of said inferences is self evident. I do think there is an over sensitivity, as you have just demonstrated.  | You said you were "hoping" someone from America would post this, but now you wonder, do any Americans read the news?
The implication (note how that's different from inference) is that Americans don't read the news or care about atrocities, etc.
What other point was there in you kicking off your post with such a statement? Would your post have suffered any without you saying that you had "hoped" an American would post this thread? I can't see a purpose in your stating that beyond taking a pot-shot at Americans here. But please explain what your point was in that statement if that's incorrect.
Also, I'm not talking about your history here. I bolded the part of your post that bugged me to make it clear to you. And evidently I'm not the only one here who took offense, so maybe instead of accusing us of interpretting you wrongly, you ought to look at what you said and try to see how it comes across to some people and why a few people are reading it that way. And yes, keeping in mind that a lot of people on the forum will go out of there way to bash America at every chance they get might be a smart idea. | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#36 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dong20 If you think this is an 'America Bashing' thread when I went out of my way to illustrate it wasn't | Don't think of a pink elephant!!
What just crossed your mind?
You did to yourself, dong...   | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#37 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy-jin You said you were "hoping" someone from America would post this, but now you wonder, do any Americans read the news? | Yes, to save me having to do so. It was a 'damn, does no-one read the news so I don't open myself up to accusations' comment - I wrote it as thought it. With the benefit of hindsight and the contrived overreaction that ensured, I probably shouldn't have written it. Wait, again - it was only you. Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy-jin The implication (note how that's different from inference) is that Americans don't read the news or care about atrocities, etc. | Actually, the second inference you draw is flawed (and no doubt added for effect) - one cannot reliably conclude that not reading the news equates to not caring about atrocities, nor the converse. However, with regard to the first, in that case you inferred something I didn't [intend to] imply.
Thanks for the English 'lesson', though I'd say the words best suited to describe it are patronising and unecessary. Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy-jin What other point was there in you kicking off your post with such a statement? Would your post have suffered any without you saying that you had "hoped" an American would post this thread? I can't see a purpose in your stating that beyond taking a pot-shot at Americans here. But please explain what your point was in that statement if that's incorrect. | Just because you can't see any other reason is your problem, not mine. I explained why already, twice at least. If you choose to ignore or disbelieve said explanation, that is of course, your prerogative. I'd rather you believed me, but do believe me when I say I won't lose sleep over it. Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy-jin Also, I'm not talking about your history here. I bolded the part of your post that bugged me to make it clear to you. And evidently I'm not the only one here who took offense, so maybe instead of accusing us of interpretting you wrongly, you ought to look at what you said and try to see how it comes across to some people and why a few people are reading it that way. | Apart from Mem's copycat 'edited in later after he read your reply' comment, I see no evidence that it was taken as America bashing - especially as it wasn't. In that sense, I'm not accusing you of misinterpreting what I wrote, you did misinterpret it.
But let me add, in the context of the above - if you don't think it was intended that way (as deliberate, in character America Bashing), why make such a song and dance of your reply, why not just say, "it's not like you to ... so what did you mean by?" Viewed in that light your response seems somewhat disingenuous. Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy-jin And yes, keeping in mind that a lot of people on the forum will go out of there way to bash America at every chance they get might be a smart idea. | I'm well aware of that, so I ask you again, do I fall into that category, and if so, based on what evidence? Because you know that isn't the case it could reasonably be inferred by me that you simply wanted to poke a stick at someone for come contrived 'Anti American' offence(s) (here or elsewhere), and I was a convenient target. if so that's as sad as it is unecessary.
The day I alter my posting style to avoid upsetting a few delicate flowers on the other side of the pond (or you) will be the day they serve Pimms in Hades, or perhaps the day after you do 'likewise'. Being misunderstood here is par for the course and some here are quick, unecessarily quick to take 'faux' offence.
I'm done with this 'explanation' - don't expect a futher response on this issue. Quote:
Originally Posted by ManlyBanisters Don't think of a pink elephant!!
What just crossed your mind?
You did to yourself, dong... | Yeah, to a degree (but see above), but talk about a hair trigger response ... | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#38 (permalink)
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 [quote=dong20;1590969]You still fail to see the irony in your comment.
Your comment was unjustified in the context of the story posted, something remarked on by another poster. Further, you not only cited a portion of my post, but specifically bolded a section of it. Now, with that in mind, do you want to try 'it wasn't aimed at you' again?
You do tend to create a large(ish) number of thread, often about trivial issues - though less than you did. Obviously that's IMO, but it's something that has been been commented on by others. While it wasn't meant to be taken hatefully I stand by the essence of the statement.
Yawn, read on did we ... all I can say is boy did you both misread that one. Are we done with this now, I know I am?[/quot e] Quote:
Originally Posted by dong20 Yes, to save me having to do so. It was a 'damn, does no-one read the news so I don't open myself up to accusations' comment - I wrote it as thought it. With the benefit of hindsight and the contrived overreaction that ensured, I probably shouldn't have written it. Wait, again - it was only you.
Actually, the second inference you draw is flawed (and no doubt added for effect) - one cannot reliably conclude that not reading the news equates to not caring about atrocities, nor the converse. However, with regard to the first, in that case you inferred something I didn't [intend to] imply.
Thanks for the English 'lesson', though I'd say the words best suited to describe it are patronising and unecessary.
Just because you can't see any other reason is your problem, not mine. I explained why already, twice at least. If you choose to ignore or disbelieve said explanation, that is of course, your prerogative. I'd rather you believed me, but do believe me when I say I won't lose sleep over it.
Apart from Mem's copycat 'edited in later after he read your reply' comment, I see no evidence that it was taken as America bashing - especially as it wasn't. In that sense, I'm not accusing you of misinterpreting what I wrote, you did misinterpret it.
But let me add, in the context of the above - if you don't think it was intended that way (as deliberate, in character America Bashing), why make such a song and dance of your reply, why not just say, "it's not like you to ... so what did you mean by?" Viewed in that light your response seems somewhat disingenuous.
I'm well aware of that, so I ask you again, do I fall into that category, and if so, based on what evidence? Because you know that isn't the case it could reasonably be inferred by me that you simply wanted to poke a stick at someone for come contrived 'Anti American' offence(s) (here or elsewhere), and I was a convenient target. if so that's as sad as it is unecessary.
The day I alter my posting style to avoid upsetting a few delicate flowers on the other side of the pond (or you) will be the day they serve Pimms in Hades, or perhaps the day after you do 'likewise'. Being misunderstood here is par for the course and some here are quick, unecessarily quick to take 'faux' offence.
I'm done with this 'explanation' - don't expect a futher response on this issue.
Yeah, to a degree (but see above), but talk about a hair trigger response ... |  Don't try to backpeddal. Just be happy to stay in the hole that you dug for yourself.
By the way don't take this interaction too personally. I barely know who you are. | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#39 (permalink)
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This poor woman is just one example of the psychological and emotional isolation that passes for modern life in this country.
We live our lives alone.... huddled up in our cars... our offices, cubicles, or our homes...
We never meet other people unless the circumstances of our jobs demand it. We don't know the names of our next door neighbors, much less those of the people we elected to govern.
And we sit, passively, in our home theaters and observe the outside world thru the artificial constructs of television shows and movies.
Everything really human is one step removed from us by the glass panel on the front of the idiot box.
The people who sat there and watched that woman slowly die on the floor, doing nothing.... they behaved exactly as if they were watching it on some reality TV show...
Television, and our solitary, self absorbed lives have taken away all ability to REACT and to ACT.
It has made of us, spectators.... unwilling and unable to meaningfully contribute anything but ratings, youtube hits, and opinions...
And... on the other topic....
As an American let me say that America DESERVES bashing.
If Americans don't like it... then get off your fat lazy, self obsessed asses and AGITATE for change...
The last time we were in a war this stupid the decent people were rioting in the streets to get it stopped.
Sorry... but from the perspective of the rest of the world, Americans seem spoiled, indolent, and amoral.
A person's standing in a community is no better than what others say about them behind their backs.
And that goes for a nation in a community of nations, too.
You want America to be thought of as being better?
ACT better. | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#40 (permalink)
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Two weeks ago, I spent 5 hours in an Emergency room when my ex- got really sick.
What I learned was that charm is the biggest coin anywhere.
Through the simple measure of politeness, I had all the attention and help that I required, as did all other people who were being "nice."
But people who were rude and demanding had a harder time getting help. I even saw them "sick" three security people on a lady who was particularly loud -- she kept yelling that her husband was bleeding... and he kept wandering around, waving his bandaged hand in the air.
Perhaps emergency room people become jaded -- maybe they think people who act weird are less worthy of help. | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#41 (permalink)
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If I were in that waiting room I would have called for the Director of the Hospital to come right away. The other people in the waiting room should sue for emotional distress for having to watch a woman die from neglect. | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#42 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Ayesho The people who sat there and watched that woman slowly die on the floor, doing nothing.... they behaved exactly as if they were watching it on some reality TV show...
Television, and our solitary, self absorbed lives have taken away all ability to REACT and to ACT.
It has made of us, spectators.... unwilling and unable to meaningfully contribute anything but ratings, youtube hits, and opinions... | That was one of the sorrier aspects of this fiasco; that it 'came to public attention' or was at least made into some sort of side show through such media. Of course it begs the question of how many Esmin Green's anbd their families go unrecognised and uncompensated. Quote:
Originally Posted by Mem If I were in that waiting room I would have called for the Director of the Hospital to come right away. The other people in the waiting room should sue for emotional distress for having to watch a woman die from neglect. | A sound strategy but ask yourself; do you think it's more likely the Director would have come - or that you have been invited to leave?
As for the other patients/people; of course it's all but impossble to know what representations they [may have] made on the patients behalf so it may be that that neglect was effected in part by their own inaction as well as that of ER staff. If that is the case, they have little right to make such a suit, also being complicit - not legally liable perhaps, but certainly ethically. Quote:
Originally Posted by Not_Punny What I learned was that charm is the biggest coin anywhere.
Through the simple measure of politeness, I had all the attention and help that I required, as did all other people who were being "nice."
...
Perhaps emergency room people become jaded -- maybe they think people who act weird are less worthy of help. | I don't doubt that many ER patients play wolf (as you and another poster suggest) and it's hard to underestimate the stress under which many ER staff must be find themselves on a daily basis, but she lay there for a long time, far more than I imagine most 'attention seekers' would.
We probably don't know the full circumstances, but it's hard to take the ER staff side in this. After all, duty of care is exactly that. | | | |
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07-04-2008
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#43 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Not_Punny Two weeks ago, I spent 5 hours in an Emergency room when my ex- got really sick.
What I learned was that charm is the biggest coin anywhere. | And yet you were still there for 5 hours  .
This woman waited 24 hours and got no treatment, and the waiting room was virtually empty. The staff clearly did not give a shit. I don't think that apathy is endemic to the US. | | | |
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07-05-2008
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#44 (permalink)
| | Banned |
Quote:
Originally Posted by Not_Punny What I learned was that charm is the biggest coin anywhere.
Through the simple measure of politeness, I had all the attention and help that I required, as did all other people who were being "nice."
But people who were rude and demanding had a harder time getting help. | An ER is not exactly a place where people should have to be "charming" to get help. Nor is it a place where many people are capable of being nice and polite. That's not exactly a priority for most people when you or someone you're close to is very ill. There's no excuse for what happened, and it seems like you're trying to lay blame on the victim.
Have you ever thought that being nice had little to do with how you were treated and the fact that you're white, attractive, and not indigent was probably a big reason you got treated well? | | | |
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07-05-2008
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#45 (permalink)
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I can honestly say, having gone with my clients to hospital waiting rooms, that if you have a nice white representative (i.e. me) who can help you navigate the system in a waiting room, you will get help faster.
The exception is if you go to the county hospital where the people who have no medical insurance are forced to go. Then they don't care at all about any of you. I sat with one client for hours, hours, with no help. Then I had to leave on another call (now this client wasn't critical or anything and could mostly fend for his/herself). He/she had to wait another 8 hours before receiving any medical attention. He/she had a bone sticking out of his/her arm. That is disgusting.
Often my clients who go to this particular county hospital are made to wait over 6 hours to get any attention. Then when they get attention, they are just injected with morphine and handed vicodin prescriptions and sent home (in the middle of the night with no transportation) without any real corrective medical attention. Basically, this county hospital drugs them up so that they are numb and then boots them out of the emergency room.
It's disgusting. Healthcare in the USA is a disgrace. And if you are mentally ill, it's so broken that most likely you will never find help (unless you find me, of course.) | | | |
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