Is bathing with ya kids abnormal?

I agree 100% with this comment. And to show my enlightened stance on this post, I'm willing to take a bath with boynextdoorkpt, any time he wants to.

Not odd at all. Many aboriginal people spend their lives nude. Could you imagine driving to Wal-Mart to buy your son his first penis sheath? These guys would think it irresponsible if you didn't:

http://waynesword.palomar.edu/images/pgourd1b.jpg

Here are some Yanomami hunting party. OMG!! You can see their genitals!!:

http://www.xtreme.nl/foto01/amazone3_290301.jpg

The women like to stay cool too:

http://indian-cultures.com/scans/Yan...0women%205.jpg

No, it's not an odd statement. Peoples like the Yanomami and the Sepik spend their entire lives nearly or completely nude and they aren't mentally ruined by the experience. There are even nudist families here in the west who spend a great deal time together completely nude and they don't spend years in therapy because they happened to glimpse another family member without any clothes on.

Prohibitions against nudity are cultural, not natural. If we have issues with nudity then it's because those prohibitions have been transmitted to us culturally even if our psychologists, physicians, and even clergy claim to state there is some natural, innate psychological reason why we shouldn't be nude around other members of our society and family.

The people shown above would think you decidedly odd if you didn't want to bathe (or do anything else) naked in a social setting.

If I seem angry about our western nudity taboo, it's because I am. As a kid and even as an adult, I am uncomfortable in nude social situations. It took me eight years of gang showers and roommates in school to begin to get over it and even then I'm still ashamed of my body and genitals. When I realized that shame was culturally-induced it made me very angry because I then realized I didn't have to feel that way. For me, sadly, getting over it is a major hurdle and one I have worked on for the last 32 years of my life. I may never get over it and I think that's a shame.

Reading comprehension clearly isn't everyone's friend.

To all those guys who are saying they bathed/showered with their fathers and it was no problem: that means nothing in this thread.

The OP is talking about bathing with his four year old DAUGHTER.

The only posts about sharing a bath or shower with a parent that is relevant in this thread are those by women who showered with their fathers growing up or boys showering with their mothers growing up.

At a certain age (like right about now) that becomes inappropriate. In fact at the age of four this girl ought to be able to bathe herself (supervised) so why get into the tub with her?

When I was five, I was bathing on my own. No supervision. Surely a four year old can do the same (with supervision if necessary).

Perhaps the OP should ask his daughter whether SHE wants him in the tub (or even in the room) so she has the opportunity to let it be know if she's feeling uncomfortable about the situation.

He's not in some third world country where water is scarce.

Another problem with bathing with a child of the opposite sex at that age is that kids like to mention things at the most inopportune time as well as embellish things as well. My aunt was being hassled by Child Protective Services for years because teachers or neighbors would overhear what her daughter said to a friend. My aunt never did anything wrong but small children love to tell stories and so something that might be totally innocent can be easily misconstrued. Especially if the child embellishes as my cousin did. For example, my cousin when she was about seven just would not stop eating and thus kept putting on weight. So my aunt got a lock for the refrigerator to stop her from helping herself 24/7. Well my cousin tells her friend about locks and whatnot but then, in hearing distance of a teacher, embellishes the story and makes it seem that my aunt is locking her in the basement and not feeding her! Needless to say, Child Protect Services came knocking and my aunt went through hell proving to them that her children were not being abused in any way.

What happens if the OP's daughter says something about daddy touching her vagina or him having a big cock (which some may think means erect and then you have people wondering why you're sporting an erection in front of your daughter)?

Again, just because you're not bathing with your old-enough-to-bathe-on-their-own child doesn't mean you're implying that nudity is evil. It's about setting boundaries and, yes, allowing them to do things for themselves rather than babying them forever.

Yeah if the poor little girl is allowed to let her father know. It seems she has no say in that matter judging by the OP asking a question about whether others find it appropriate or not and then dismissing anyone who says it's not appropriate. Seems like he'll shower with the girl for as long as he wants no matter what anyone says.

Unfortunately, pedophiles always tell themselves certain things to make it "okay".

there was nothing in the op that implied she had no choice.
mine bugged to share a bath long after i'd phased it out.

and you compare a parent bathing with a child to pedophilia??????? wtf?

Welcome to America! Now aren't you glad you shipped off all your Puritans to the colonies?

and where the hell did you pull that one from????

sharing a bath doesn't mean washing her private parts for her. it means sharing a bath.

bathing your child (while they are young) - normal

bathing WITH your child - questionable

i'm honestly shocked by how warped and twisted some people's minds are.

i loved your post about the aboriginal people...people who never tasted the apple, lol.
they live together naked.
they aren't perverts and they aren't damaged.

Look... I am all for sexual freedom and entirely agasint the kind of sexual self loathing that our puritanical society foists upon our children...

But you are off base.

BSD is comparing a Father SHOWERING with his daughter to pedophilia ... and, I have to say, its a valid comparison.


Think about it.... A home shower is a confining space for two... you have to be under the shower head to not get cold....How TALL is she? Standing in the shower next to her father...
What is right in her face?

IS he washing her? Touching her? Why the hell can she not handle this activity on her own... MOST people shower solo, and when they shower with others, its their significant others.

WHY THE HELL IS THE FATHER DOING THIS? If the daughter needs a shower, why not with the mother?

Ask yourself a simple question...

IF the exact same thing were happening and the man was her Uncle? Her Pastor? THe next door neighbor? Would it seem as "innocent".


Saying that it being the father makes it okay is to deny the fact that it is a RED FLAG of unusual interest.
No matter HOW innocently it starts... the child is getting older every day... the father is sharing an intimate space with a young female.


This kind of parental "open mindedness" is HOW incestuous abuse begins.


Sure she is an innocent child.
HE IS NOT.

And no... the OP did not say she had no choice... Neither did he say she HAD a choice...
He left that nugget of information out...

If she had no choice... do you honestly think he would say so?

How much can you trust him to evaluate his OWN behavior? Would he even recognize the subtle pressure that a parent can bring to bear on a child?


Sorry dolfette.... it stinks on ice...
a Father showering with a daughter is simply inappropriate.

With all due respect Phil, then no, you're really not against any of that. This was the attitude of my parents as well. They'd say, "There's nothing wrong with nudity, it's natural, blah blah blah," because that's what Dr. Spock told them to say. The reality was very different and sent some very confusing signals. I see the same thing here. You claim one thing but then spend 80% of the post denying what you just claimed!

Something I think some child psychologists get right: If you really and truly believe that nudity equates to a sexual situation then don't say one thing but do another. Just say outright that you think nudity is inappropriate. On the other hand, if you truly do not believe that nudity equates to sex, then raise your kids that way. Waffling, it seems, does more damage than admitting to yourself that you do have bias.


I don't see an issue with a daughter bathing with her father no matter the height or whatever. I do have an issue with her giving him a blow job, which seems to be what sparks the fear underlying the situation. The two are not related. Sure she might comment on his penis. I'd think it strange if she didn't because kids are curious. Simple explanations with age-appropriate information is all that's needed. Once her curiosity is satisfied then you move on. The key is that the father can't be uncomfortable about it. If he is, then his daughter will detect that discomfort and realize there's something not right and that is where problems occur.

Right now, I can honestly say I don't think I could bathe with my daughter though I wish I could be that open and relaxed about it because I think it would be best for her sense of well-being. I could bathe with my son, no problem, because I'm comfortable enough with shared male nudity in such situations that it truly doesn't bother me and, therefore, I won't subconsciously transmit mixed messages about nudity in male company being inappropriate.

I'm just glad to know that no one jumped all over my ass for bathing with my 6 year old. Since 4 seems to be the magic number like Snoozie said.

Actually, Jason... if you read more of my other posts, you will find that I am quite clear.

WHile I do not think that child sexual experience is as histrionic a tragedy as our puritanical society makes it out... that I feel that the hysteria over the "shame" of sex does most of the harm in trying to recover from childhood sexual abuse...

That does not mean I think child sexual abuse is "okay". Its still abuse... its still inappropriate, and it can still screw up a child for life....



That you don't see an issue is an example of your naivete.
This is not a culture of communal showering.... its a culture wherein showering is something either private or intimate.

Your argument is specious because it assumes that we can not SUSPECT anything unless something illegal occurs.

This is like sayihng that men walking into a bank with masks on should be treated just like any other patron, with no additional suspicion nor investigation, because they have not actually robbed the bank yet.

Its an argument from the perspective of oblivious optimism.



The FACTS are that incestuous pedophilia ALWAYS begins with undue physical familiarity between the parent and the child.

The Facts are that parents can override their own children's feelings of inappropriateness with their own pressures, agendas, and influences... and not even be aware that they are doing so.


And the facts are that, even if the father is NOT a pedophile... at some point the daughter ceases to LOOK like a child... at some point she starts menses and starts giving off the hormonal cues that she is sexually mature...



Human culture has ALWAYS had taboos about certain kinds of contact between parents and children.


If you were arguing that a family going to a nude beach together was not an issue... I would tend to agree.

If you were arguing that a family of nudists sharing the communal living area
was not an issue, I would agree.

Seeing your dad walk from the bathroom to the bedroom naked is not a big deal, if your FAMILY is comfortable with nudity.


However... we are not talking about a FAMILY ethic.... we are talking about something that happens behind a locked door, inside a small, confined space, where physical contact is unavoidable, and where no one else can see what is going on.


I am not calling the man a pedophile... This MIGHT be perfectly innocent.

But its simply unconscionable not to admit that this is suspicious on its face.

There is nothing wrong with a man being naked with his daughter.

But for a man to seek private, confined, and potentially secret time with his daughter, in a context of touching and carressing....

Sorry... where there is smoke... you often find something burning.

my 7 and 11 year old kids just came in for a chat while i was in the bath.
they're too big to come in...or the tub is too small, lol...but they still feel comfortable chatting to me. they don't even look at my body because it's just my body.

if you're noth happy then don't worry about what those old puritans think