People of Faith

I was raised in a christian home. I have read the christian holy bible (several translations, several times, cover to cover), the torah, the book of mormon, the baghavad gita, and excerpts from the qu'ran.

I actually did struggle with belief vs. faith, for a long time, and did truly want to have a spiritual/religious aspect of myself. But the more I read, and researched, and searched, the LESS I believed, until I came to my current total lack of theology, about 15 years ago.

I've known people of all different flavors of religion throughout my life, and liked some better than others. But as long as they practice their beliefs without trying to involve me, that's just fine.

There are two problem that I have with religion ad faith "in a higher being."

First, which religion is correct? There are dozens and dozens of them and they all believe that theirs is "the only true faith." For instance, Baptists believe that if you do not believe exactly as they believe, you go to hell - no questions asked! So, if you were born in a part of the world (say, the Amazon) where you have no access to the Christianity (particularly, the Baptist version), you will suffer for eternity! That makes no sense at all.

Second, scientific evidence eliminates their possibility (i.e., evolution). Evolution is a pillar of modern biology - there are no respected biologist in the world who think that there is even a possibility that evolution is wrong. They know it to be fact, pure and simple. Aren't we just an intelligent primate, aren't monkey related to us? You have to see the smilarities there - you just have to.

Those to issues are clear and distinct. Period.

*During the last election cycle in the US, a friend of mine told me a story that happened in her church. She said that the preacher stood before his congregation and told them that if they did not vote for Republicans on election day that they would be sinning against God! That is not an isolated event. I would like to see a voter's identification card with God's name on it! http://www.lpsg.org/images/icons/icon8.gif

1. I have read the Bible, the Q'uran, the Upanishads, and Baghavad Ghita. I have also read Baha'i texts.

2. How could anybody answer the second question? I may have a genetic predisposition toward believing in a power greater than myself. If that's the case, I'd have been the same sort of believer in another religion as I am in the one I currently practice. There's no real way to rewind my life and start it in Mecca or Joppa.

Just remember, the answer is 42 !!!!!

Actually, the numbers to remember are

4 8 15 16 23 42

every 108 minutes.

Sorry that one is Lost on me

Yes, to a very large extent. I also have a few friends who are devotees of several "great faiths" and I often ask them questions to gain a more intimate knowledge and possibly fill in the gaps that reading text could only hope to do.

Well, it's impossible to tell, I guess.

I have a longer more indept response, but I'll give later.

Religion and the theory of evolution are not imcompatible. Many devout Christians, I included, accept the theory of evolution as being valid.

*cough*

The racist "Curse of Cain" doctrine barred blacks from the Mormon priesthood until as late as 1978. Why has it not received any formal repudiation?

I grew up Mormon, and clearly remember when the change of doctrine happened. It was a few years later I finally abandoned the church for good. Not over this issue, because I thought it was a strupid doctrine to bar black people from the preisthood, in the name of "protecting " them, but mainly because I could no longer stomach the blatant hypocracy and hatred and ostricization of anybody who wasn;t a member. I got some decent moral values out of that upbringing, and I try to hold those to this day, but people should never be allowed to run religions---they always screw it all up, in the name of God. IN this case, hate the players, not the game.

I certainly respect and admire Pecker, for his wit, wisdom and intellegence. He has shown great restraint and consideration when others let loose with far more vehemence than is often justified, including myself. I may not always agree with his ideas or philosophy, but also recognize that those ideals helped shape the fine man that he is today, and for that reason, if no other, find value in them. Isn't it time for a Pecker appreciation thread?

You have given a very interesting answer.

Some people of faith will deny that they could have a different faith because their's is the only true faith.

Yes, and their answer is so stupid on so many levels that I find it hard to reply. It categorically denies reality. 'Course, that's at the heart of "Christianity", the way so many practice it today.

The older I get, the less inclined I am to see things in dualistic, "black vs. white", "this vs that" terms. Is mine the one true faith? It works for me. That's all I know.

As far as proselytizing goes, I try to stay out of it. In this part of the world people talk about "presenting the Gospel" to others as a means of converting them, as if it were a sales presentation and there were nothing more at stake than whether the "customer" buys or not. It really is easier to convert others, because theoretically it takes less time and effort than that required to love and understand. But the Bible never says anything about converting anybody. Christ didn't do it, and so-called "Christians" are supposed to be following His example, not making up shit on their own.

As I Baptist, I have a problem with this statement. There are so many "flavors" of Baptists that the above generality is an untruth. Baptists run the gamut from ultra-liberal to ultra-conservative. One can find Baptists that border on Unitarian beliefs and one can find Baptists that make the staunchest conservatives look liberal. Being that Baptists are not organized into denominations, per se, but are organized into "associations", churches are independant and organize with like minded churches. So while there are some major groups, Such as the Southern Baptist Convention, which is pretty conservative overall, there are more moderate groups like the American Baptist Churches, USA, and there are some extremely fundamentalist groups like the Landmark Baptist Churches or the white Missionary Baptist churches that scatter the southern US. (not to be confused with any Black Baptist church that has the words "Missionary Baptist" in its name)

As a member of a predominantly Black Missionary Baptist church, I would take offense that you have to believe EXACTLY the same way I do. One of the main Baptist tenets (that Southern Baptists seem to have forgotten) is that Baptists believe in freedom of belief. That is why there are so many Baptist sects. One group would fight over some point of belief and break off into a new group.

I think that there are some major points that a Christian must believe in, but other than those major points, many of the rest of the points that we argue over are man-made rules. Who cares if we're supposed to use wine or grape juice for communion or how often we're supposed to celebrate it. Who cares what instruments we use in worship services. Let's deal with the real issues of the faith--proclaiming the Gospel to the people who haven't heard it and helping those in need. Acting as Jesus to others. That's what being a Christian is about. It's not about judging, it's not about hating. It's about sharing God's love. Of course, it's not that simple, but that's a quick summary since I don't have pages and pages to write in this forum.

(Bold added.)

Indeed, David, wiser words are rarely spoken.