Kill the bill and Start Over

Trinity · 10-01-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Industrialsize

I think it's a good thing that HUMANA(a health insurance company) has been told they can no longer LIE to seniors to scare them.

Humana wasn't lying. Obama and the Democrats are lying when they state no benefits would be cut from Medicare for seniors. Significant benefits are cut from Medicare Advantage and this is straight from testimony of the Director of the CBO:

Baucus called the Humana mailing “false,” while the CMS said it was “misleading” and “confusing.” However, the director of the Congressional Budget Office (CBO), Douglas Elmendorf, testified before Baucus’ Senate Finance Committee that, in fact, the administration’s planned cuts to Medicare Advantage would result in seniors losing “more than half” of the added benefits they receive from the privately run program. -CNSnews. com

Industrialsize · 10-01-2009

Humana made national news last week when it was sanctioned by the federal government for falsely warning seniors that health insurance reform would cut their health care benefits. Currently the federal government pays private insurance companies like Humana, on average, 14% more for providing coverage to Medicare Advantage clients than it would to pay for the same care under traditional Medicare. Humana profits from wasteful overpayments to Medicare Advantage programs and wants to keep it that way.

Tony Fransetta, President of the Florida Alliance for Retired Americans, said, "What Humana is doing is unconscionable. Although payments to Humana under Medicare Advantage have increased drastically in the last several years, benefits and services for seniors have not. Now, to add insult to injury, Humana has mailed to its Medicare Advantage recipients false information about health insurance reform. Now is our chance to cut wasteful overpayments to the big insurance companies. This will be good for Medicare, it will be good for seniors and ultimately good for all Americans."

Lost in all this righteous indignation are some basic facts about Humana's role and obligations as a government contractor. Humana's communications did not take the form of a generic advertising campaign or mass mailing -- something the insurer was and remains free to do. Rather, Humana mailed a letter to Medicare Advantage members whose names and addresses were provided by the federal government.
National Journal Online - GOP Overreacts To CMS 'Gag Order'

CMS has learned that Humana has been contacting enrollees in one or more of its plans and alleging that current health care reform legislation affecting Medicare could hurt "millions of seniors and disabled individuals [who] could lose many of the important benefits and services that make Medicare advantage health plans so valuable." The message makes several other claims about the legislation and how it will be detrimental to enrollees, ultimately urging enrollees to contact their congressional representatives to protest the actions referenced in the letter...
CMS is concerned that, among other things, this information is misleading and confusing to
beneficiaries, represents information to beneficiaries as official communications about the
Medicare Advantage program, and is potentially contrary to federal regulations and guidance for the MA and Part D programs and other federal law, including HIPAA. As we continue our
research into this issue, we are instructing you to end immediately all such mailings to
beneficiaries and to remove any related materials directed to Medicare enrollees from your
website.

Read more at: Humana Letter: GOP Defends Insurance Company's Misleading Anti-Reform Effort

Humana Letter: GOP Defends Insurance Company's Misleading Anti-Reform Effort

JTalbain · 10-01-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trinity

Humana wasn't lying. Obama and the Democrats are lying when they state no benefits would be cut from Medicare for seniors. Significant benefits are cut from Medicare Advantage and this is straight from testimony of the Director of the CBO:

Baucus called the Humana mailing “false,” while the CMS said it was “misleading” and “confusing.” However, the director of the Congressional Budget Office (CBO), Douglas Elmendorf, testified before Baucus’ Senate Finance Committee that, in fact, the administration’s planned cuts to Medicare Advantage would result in seniors losing “more than half” of the added benefits they receive from the privately run program. -CNSnews. com

Suppose his interpretation didn't include the reduction of healthcare costs that are also planned? So we could cover the same number of people for a lower amount by being more efficient and providing better preventative care, both initiatives being pushed for by both Democrats and Republicans? And again no annotations as to where in the bill this is?

www.congress.org Still waiting Trinity.

Trinity · 10-01-2009

Thanks for posting that. That explanation is the exact reason why Obama and Democrats need to kill all their bills and start over on real healthcare refom.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Industrialsize

Humana made national news last week when it was sanctioned by the federal government for falsely warning seniors that health insurance reform would cut their health care benefits.

As already backed up by the CBO, cuts to Medicare Advantage would cut seniors' benefits.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Industrialsize

Currently the federal government pays private insurance companies like Humana, on average, 14% more for providing coverage to Medicare Advantage clients than it would to pay for the same care under traditional Medicare.

Completely Wrong.

Quote:

Medicare Advantage plans are bought by Medicare patients to extend benefits and coordinate with Medicare. The only reason to purchase them in the first place is to get better coverage than what Medicare provides. Arguing that people won’t lose anything because Medicare requires insurers to meet the same requirements as Medicare is...

nothing short of stupid!

Hotair.com

Obama and the Democrats in congress truly think the American people are stupid. Thank God for Humana sending out those mailers to wake up seniors to what Obama and the Dems are trying to do. The Cuts to Medicare Advantage amount to healthcare RATIONING for seniors. Obama is telling seniors get care from Medicare that he knows is not there because that's cheaper for us.

To add insult to injury, it makes Obama a bold face liar...because he is going back on his statement: "If you like your current coverage, you keep your coverage."

YouTube - CBO Director Douglas Elmendorf on Medicare Advantage

This video provides testimony that seniors on Medicare Advantage would lose half their benefits!

Quote:

Currently, between 20%-25% of all Medicare enrollees buy Medicare Advantage plans, which means that these changes impact a lot of people.

Hotair

Quote:

Originally Posted by Industrialsize

Humana profits from wasteful overpayments to Medicare Advantage programs and wants to keep it that way.

Wrong. And you know what's scary. How are the American people going to know if Obama puts a Gag Order on the TRUTH?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Industrialsize

Tony Fransetta, President of the Florida Alliance for Retired Americans, said, "What Humana is doing is unconscionable. Although payments to Humana under Medicare Advantage have increased drastically in the last several years, benefits and services for seniors have not. Now, to add insult to injury, Humana has mailed to its Medicare Advantage recipients false information about health insurance reform. Now is our chance to cut wasteful overpayments to the big insurance companies. This will be good for Medicare, it will be good for seniors and ultimately good for all Americans."

Nope. Completely wrong.

Quote:

On average, the government pays these plans about 114 percent of what traditional Medicare costs. Insurers’ administrative costs and profits consume some of the extra money, but much of it is spent on benefits that are not provided by fee-for-service Medicare. In some high-cost areas, like Florida and New York, senior HMOs have long received exceptionally high payments because of the historical cost of providing care in those states. The benefits of those plans are correspondingly rich. If the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services (CMS) moves forward with the bidding approach that has been proposed, plans in Miami, New York, and Los Angeles will see their budgets set below the historical costs of traditional Medicare. Will they respond by slashing benefits? You bet.

Tell The Truth About Medicare Advantage Plan Benefits

This article was written by an author of a book on healthcare reform who is a supporter of Obama healthcare reform. He also didn't subscribe to the Republican claims of "free speech" on the Humana mailers...and yet and still he had to tell the truth about the proposed cuts to benefits for seniors!

Quote:

Yet, in this particular case, the Administration is shooting itself in the foot by not leveling with the public about the tradeoffs involved in cutting payments to Medicare Advantage plans.

ObamaCare is a fallacy and an affront to the American People.

VinylBoy · 10-01-2009

Forum troll is much more readable after it's been translated in Fudd:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twinity

Danks fow posting that. Dat expwanation is the exact weason why Obama and Democwats need to kiww aww theiw biwws and stawt ovew on weaw heawthcawe wefom.

As awweady backed up by the CBO, cuts to Medicawe Advantage wouwd cut seniows' benefits. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit!

Compwetewy Wwong.

nothing showt of stupid!
Hotaiw.com

Obama and the Democwats in congwess twuwy think the Amewican peopwe awe stupid. Dank God fow Humana sending out those maiwews to wake up seniows to what Obama and the Dems awe twying to do. De Cuts to Medicawe Advantage amount to heawthcawe WATIONING fow seniows. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit! Obama is tewwing seniows get cawe fwom Medicawe that he knows is not thewe because that's cheapew fow us. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit!

To add insuwt to injuwy, it makes Obama a bowd face wiaw...because he is going back on his statement: "If you wike youw cuwwent covewage, you keep youw covewage."

Dis video pwovides testimony that seniows on Medicawe Advantage wouwd wose hawf theiw benefits!

Wwong. And you know what's scawy. How awe the Amewican peopwe going to know if Obama puts a Gag Owdew on the TWUD?

Nope. Compwetewy wwong.

Dis awticwe was wwitten by an authow of a book on heawthcawe wefowm who is a suppowtew of Obama heawthcawe wefowm. He awso didn't subscwibe to the Wepubwican cwaims of "fwee speech" on the Humana maiwews. Oh, dat scwewy wabbit! ..and yet and stiww he had to teww the twuf about the pwoposed cuts to benefits fow seniows!

ObamaCawe is a fawwacy and an affwont to the Amewican Peopwe.

Yeah... MUCH more entertaining. Hu-hu-hu-hu-hu!

Next week... we'll read Forum Troll as interpreted by the Swedish Chef.

Quote:

Vrung. Und yuoo knoo vhet's scery. Bork bork bork! Hoo ere-a zee Emereecun peuple-a gueeng tu knoo iff Oobema poots a Geg Oorder oon zee TROoTH?

Till next time!!!

Dustydo · 10-01-2009

Here is a novel suggestion.....

KILL THE THREAD AND DON'T START ANOTHER!

Industrialsize · 10-01-2009

No one is trampling on Humana's First Amendment Rights. They are a government Contractor and as such, used a government mailing list to try to protect their bottom line also known as Profits. By doing so there is the "appearance' that this mailing came from the government and not from an insurance company trying to MAKE MONEY on health care. They are perfectly within their rights to do a Mass mailing, newspaper ad, television ad etc. What they are NOT allowed to do is use a government owned mailing list to do a "targeted" campaign to try and sway public opinion to protect their PROFITS.

HazelGod · 10-01-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dustydo

Here is a novel suggestion.....

KILL THE THREAD AND DON'T START ANOTHER!

What she said!

ZOS23xy · 10-01-2009

Reading Trinity material in Elmer Fuddese is a big give away. We knew Trinity was a big Fudd head anyway.

VinylBoy · 10-01-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZOS23xy

Reading Trinity material in Elmer Fuddese is a big give away. We knew Trinity was a big Fudd head anyway.

It certainly makes it worth reading... THAT's for sure.
Oh, dat scwewy wabbit!

Trinity · 10-01-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Industrialsize

No one is trampling on Humana's First Amendment Rights. They are a government Contractor and as such, used a government mailing list to try to protect their bottom line also known as Profits. By doing so there is the "appearance' that this mailing came from the government and not from an insurance company trying to MAKE MONEY on health care. They are perfectly within their rights to do a Mass mailing, newspaper ad, television ad etc. What they are NOT allowed to do is use a government owned mailing list to do a "targeted" campaign to try and sway public opinion to protect their PROFITS.

This isn't about improper use of a federal mailing list. It's about Obama and the Dems not wanting information to go out to seniors.

from your article:

Quote:

One reason the Humana dispute has gotten so overheated is that CMS called the insurer's Medicare warnings "misleading and confusing to beneficiaries." Republicans retort that Humana was spot on, and that its Medicare message was accurate.

National Journal

Their focus isn't on investigating use of a mailing list...but the content of the mailing being contrary to their liking.

Your initial post was all about the Obama position which was inaccurate as the CBO testified to.

Obama and the Dems presented bogus information, imposed a questionable gag order to keep Seniors in the dark, and then started a unjustified investigation on Humana.

ObamaCare is a fallacy and an affront to the American People.

ZipperRipper · 10-01-2009

Wow...we're STILL talking about all of this?

The bill that is now being discussed in Congress is a complete farce. The only good thing about it is the stipulation that people cannot be turned down for insurance because of a pre-existing condition. Everything else is designed to make private insurance companies even MORE rich than they already are because now EVERYONE will HAVE to buy insurance or face a penalty. Where's the reform in that?

HazelGod · 10-01-2009

The man makes a good point.

Zeuhl34 · 10-01-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trinity

This isn't about improper use of a federal mailing list. It's about Obama and the Dems not wanting information to go out to seniors.

Well, who cares about old people? Isn't the government gonna euthanize them anyway?

Domisoldo · 10-01-2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by giozam

Wow...we're STILL talking about all of this?

The bill that is now being discussed in Congress is a complete farce. The only good thing about it is the stipulation that people cannot be turned down for insurance because of a pre-existing condition. Everything else is designed to make private insurance companies even MORE rich than they already are because now EVERYONE will HAVE to buy insurance or face a penalty. Where's the reform in that?

Agreed. What a squandering of political credit!

As for pre-existing conditions, who knows if in the end they will not let insurers circumvent the interdiction by simply pricing those consumers out of coverage, through loopholes in risk adjustment and premium rating provisions.

I am appalled by the lack of imagination and the insane amount of red tape implied in all those competing proposals.

Kill the bill and Start Over

Originally Posted by Industrialsize I think it's a good thing that HUMANA(a health insurance company ) has been told they can no longer LIE to seniors to scare them. Humana wasn't lying. Obama and the